[vorbis] TAG Standard - ENSEMBLE/PERFORMER tags

[Craig Dickson]

Jonathan Walther wrote:

> I think in keeping with the spirit of tags in Ogg its better to say
> ENSEMBLE=London Symphony Orchestra
> instead of
> PERFORMER=London Symphony Orchestra (orchestra)
> which would require additional parsing.

I wouldn't bother with (orchestra) -- it's redundant. I would see it
more like this:

PERFORMER=London Symphony Orchestra
PERFORMER=James Galway (flute)

In other words, use the parentheses only to call out special cases.
The orchestra is obviously an ensemble by its name, anyway.

> People are welcome to ignore ENSEMBLE and use PERFORMER for everything
> they used ARTIST for.  But when listening to classical music, you are
> often more interested in knowing who the ensemble is than knowing who
> the solo performers are.

Sometimes that's true, but not when the soloist is world-famous. Or, for
that matter, the conductor -- the ideal marquee order for all these tags
depends a lot on who's involved in the recording. I don't think you can
really standardize it and get optimal results in most cases. It also may
make a difference whether the CD the file came from was credited to the
soloist or not. Was it a Luciano Pavarotti album where he happened to be
backed by an orchestra, or was it a full production of an opera where he
was just one of several soloists?

> COPYRIGHT and PUBLISHER are nods to the music industry.  I was told by
> several people, including the webmaster for Hyperion records that these
> tags are necessary for radio streaming.  Maybe I should have added a
> fourth goal:
> 
> 5) Within reason, support the music industries attempts to make money

So would this be a correct usage of these tags?

TITLE=Band on the Run
PERFORMER=Paul McCartney and Wings
LABEL=Capitol
PUBLISHER=Thorn/EMI
COPYRIGHT=1973 MPL Communications

Explanation: This album is on the Capitol label (in the USA, at the
present time); Capitol Records is owned by Thorn/EMI; Paul McCartney's
company MPL Communications owns the copyrights to his recordings. I'm
assuming that one should put the year of first publication in the
COPYRIGHT tag because, last I heard, that's a requirement for a valid
copyright notice.

If the above is correct, then I understand what these tags are for, and
withdraw my objections to them.

> >The distinction between AUTHOR and LYRICIST is not exactly meaningless,
> >but also not terribly helpful. I would prefer the simplicity of using a
> >single field for "the people who wrote the words", whatever you want to
> >call it. (Actually, the problem of what to call such a field may be the
> >best argument for keeping them separate!) There may be an argument for
> >also merging COMPOSER in with these, but it's less significant.
> 
> Thats the problem with PERFORMER and ENSEMBLE too.  No really good middle
> ground.  If you could find a term that would resolve the distinction
> between an "individual" and a "group"...

Well, if we can get away from nouns, you could say PERFORMEDBY, which
would carry no connotation of number.

But I really don't mind PERFORMER=London Symphony Orchestra. Quantity
isn't the issue. AUTHOR and LYRICIST are hard to unify because while
they both refer to "who wrote the words", the words in question are
different in nature. Lyrics are typically in verse, and fit to music;
spoken words may not be. There isn't a word in general use that fits
both. In contrast, you're essentially using ENSEMBLE as a plural of
PERFORMER, or to denote a collective of PERFORMERs, so it makes sense to
me to just use the PERFORMER tag without regard to the number of people
denoted by it.

The CONDUCTOR tag, in contrast, is genuinely useful because there are a
number of people who both perform as soloists and conduct (usually not
in the same recording). No similar confusion is possible between a
PERFORMER and an ENSEMBLE. Itzhak Perlman can't be an ENSEMBLE, and the
Boston Symphony Orchestra can't be mistaken for a soloist.

As I see someone else has noted in another reply to you, you seem to be
the only person supporting the ENSEMBLE tag. As far as I can recall,
everyone else who has expressed an opinion on the subject is against it.

Craig

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