[vorbis] bitrtate peeling and lossless compression

[Josh Coalson]

> --- Kenneth Arnold <ken at arnoldnet.net> wrote:
> > On Thu, Mar 22, 2001 at 02:47:39PM -0500, Myles Buckley wrote:
> > > If you want truly lossless compression then look at (in
> alphabetical order)
> > > LPAC - http://www-ft.ee.tu-berlin.de/~liebchen/lpac.html, Monkey
> Audio - 
> > > http://www.monkeysaudio.com/index.html, RK Audio - 
> > > http://rksoft.virtualave.net/rkau.html or Squish - we all know
> where to
> > find
> > > this one.
> > 
> > Has somebody been overloooking FLAC? http://flac.sourceforg.net/
> > 
> > > These will allow you to get the EXACT input file at a later time.
>  AFAIK, 
> > > there is no method of 'peeling' any of these.
> > 
> > Lossless codecs are typically used for production and archival. For
> > distribution almost everyone uses a lossy codec. Until Monty gets
> > cascading and peeling in Vorbis, you can store the raw sound data
> in
> > e.g. FLAC, then decompress and encode with Vorbis for any
> > distribution.
> 
> This is actually what I'm doing now.  I still have a bunch of files
> as waves,
> but the stuff I've been doing lately is compressed with FLAC.  Still,
> though,
> what I really want is a single file that I can play as is, retrieve
> the
> original (for re-encoding or CD burning), and peel down to get a
> smaller
> lower-quality file.
> 
> I'm using FLAC instead of any of the other myriad lossless
> compression programs
> because it's free, open source, and works on all the OS's I'm
> running; most of
> the same reasons I like Ogg.
> 
> Kenneth Arnold mentions "we all know where to find" Squish.  I have a
> many-years-old copy of squish, but I haven't been able to find it
> recently.  I
> know development has been interrupted, but I can't even find an old
> copy on the
> 'net.  Am I just blind to something obvious?
> 
Actually, I asked Monty about this a while ago and he pointed
me to the right place, and I've lost the e-mail since then.  It
*is* still out there somewhere.

I have done some comparisons of Squish and FLAC but haven't
had a chance to update my comparison page with the results.  I can
say that the '98 version of Squish had trouble holding it's own with
today's codecs, and even Shorten 2.3.  Not saying that Monty couldn't
improve it!  Just that it is probably not going to be helpful
for you now.  FLAC currently gets much better compression.

Josh

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