[vorbis] 16 KHz clip-off?

[Gian-Carlo Pascutto]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Maik Merten" <maikmerten at gmx.net>
To: <vorbis at xiph.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 14, 2001 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [vorbis] 16 KHz clip-off?

> > MP3 was never designed to handle more than 16kHz either.
> > Trying to go beind that usually only worsens the sound
> > unless real high (>=256kbps) bitrates are used.
>
> MP3 is old, old, old. It is extremely inefficient (hope that´s
> spelled right) in encoding high frequencies. I thought
> Vorbis was better in high-frequencies. (I think it is!)

The issue with MP3 is the lack of scalefactor for the
last scalefactor band (> 16kHz).

But that is exactly my point. There lack of scalefactor is
there because the designers thought it was unneeded anyway.

It's not like the human hearing has significantly changed
since '95 :)

> In Beta4 it was enough. (At least according to the material
> I encoded. I could not hear artifacts - the high-freq-area
> sounded very nice.)

There were problems in the other end of the spectrum IIRC.

> I did the frequency-analysis because I felt something
> was strange when I listened to some samples.
> It was not the other way round.

That doesn't have to have to do with the 16kHz cutoff
but could be because of general encoder problems.
(which I do believe RC2 has)

> Beta4 is my favorite on this track. I don´t hear any annoying
> artifacts but it sounds brighter and "cleaner". (opinions may
> vary - no... they *will* vary) But differences are small.
> And, as said above, I don´t have golden ears and I am not an
> experienced "test-listener" (I can hear MP3 artifacts, no
> problem, but this is a completely different story...)

Quite a bit of people seem to be of the opinion that beta4 had
better quality, or at least that RC2 is not all that better.

> In Beta4 it did not. Why was the 112 kbps mode removed? No time
> to tune it?

I think so.


--
GCP

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