From boyaci at cs.columbia.edu Wed Aug 20 08:59:48 2008 From: boyaci at cs.columbia.edu (Omer Boyaci) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:59:48 -0400 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp Message-ID: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> Hi, First of all, thanks for your effort for RTP specs. The latest draft for theora-rtp is from July 2006 at http://svn.xiph.org/trunk/theora/doc/draft-ietf-avt-rtp-theora-00.txt. Do you think to publish it as an RFC? If yes, do you have an approximate date? What is your suggestion to implementers? Implement the draft from 2006 or just their own implementation? Sincerely, Omer Boyaci -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.xiph.org/pipermail/xiph-rtp/attachments/20080820/68c8e1d3/attachment.htm From lu_zero at gentoo.org Wed Aug 20 09:13:32 2008 From: lu_zero at gentoo.org (Luca Barbato) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:13:32 +0200 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> Omer Boyaci wrote: > Hi, > > First of all, thanks for your effort for RTP specs. > > The latest draft for theora-rtp is from July 2006 at > http://svn.xiph.org/trunk/theora/doc/draft-ietf-avt-rtp-theora-00.txt. severely outdated. > > Do you think to publish it as an RFC? No, I'll do a makeover and proposed something aligned to rfc5215 > If yes, do you have an approximate date? Right now I'm recovering from what showed up to be a pneumonia, I think I'll start pushing updates by September. > What is your suggestion to implementers? Check what is implemented in feng (lscube.polito.it) and in gstreamer, to my knowledge those 2 independent implementation are pretty much in a good shape. > Implement the draft from 2006 or just their own implementation? Either wait for an update or check those 2 implementations. Theora will be packed the same way Vorbis is. lu -- Luca Barbato Gentoo Council Member Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero From justivo at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 09:19:53 2008 From: justivo at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Ivo_Emanuel_Gon=C3=A7alves?=) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 17:19:53 +0100 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> Message-ID: On 8/20/08, Luca Barbato wrote: > severely outdated. There's a more recent version at http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-barbato-avt-rtp-theora-01.txt but I'm led to believe it contains some wrong information. > rfc5215 For those not following recent events, this is the Vorbis RTP spec. It has finally become an RFC thanks to the efforts of Luca. >> What is your suggestion to implementers? Besides the two implementations Luca mentioned, you should check on what the XMPP/Jingle people are doing. Theora is being/will be used for video communications over Jabber. -Ivo From stpeter at stpeter.im Wed Aug 20 09:22:03 2008 From: stpeter at stpeter.im (Peter Saint-Andre) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 10:22:03 -0600 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> Message-ID: <48AC44AB.2010908@stpeter.im> Ivo Emanuel Gon?alves wrote: > On 8/20/08, Luca Barbato wrote: >> severely outdated. > > There's a more recent version at > http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-barbato-avt-rtp-theora-01.txt but I'm > led to believe it contains some wrong information. > >> rfc5215 > > For those not following recent events, this is the Vorbis RTP spec. > It has finally become an RFC thanks to the efforts of Luca. > >>> What is your suggestion to implementers? > > Besides the two implementations Luca mentioned, you should check on > what the XMPP/Jingle people are doing. Theora is being/will be used > for video communications over Jabber. I'm pretty sure support for that is in Pidgin (well, it will be once the Summer of Code work is incorporated). /psa -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 7338 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature Url : http://lists.xiph.org/pipermail/xiph-rtp/attachments/20080820/57459743/attachment.bin From lu_zero at gentoo.org Wed Aug 20 10:47:22 2008 From: lu_zero at gentoo.org (Luca Barbato) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 19:47:22 +0200 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: <48AC44AB.2010908@stpeter.im> References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> <48AC44AB.2010908@stpeter.im> Message-ID: <48AC58AA.6050208@gentoo.org> Peter Saint-Andre wrote: > I'm pretty sure support for that is in Pidgin (well, it will be once the > Summer of Code work is incorporated). People involved in separate implementation are more than welcome to contact me so I could know who is using it ^^; lu -- Luca Barbato Gentoo Council Member Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero From boyaci at cs.columbia.edu Wed Aug 20 11:41:35 2008 From: boyaci at cs.columbia.edu (Omer Boyaci) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 14:41:35 -0400 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: <48AC58AA.6050208@gentoo.org> References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> <48AC44AB.2010908@stpeter.im> <48AC58AA.6050208@gentoo.org> Message-ID: <71B566D5-C5FA-46AE-A7EA-659F6A3EFFDC@cs.columbia.edu> Yes, it seems that XMPP/Jingle supports theora-rtp http://www.xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0167.html I believe that, the life will be easy for developers of different systems if there would be an RFC for theora. Otherwise, there will be different implementations. We have also developed an application and desktop sharing system which supports theora, but I used my own payload format in the implementation due to lack of an RFC spec for theora. Our paper will be published in IEEE International Symposium on Multimedia 2008. We will also preparing an RFC for application and desktop sharing. It will support all media formats, but we will recommend Theora because it is good enough, open source and license free. Also, MJPEG--RTP RFC gives some example C code for de/packetization. I believe, Luca can also add an appendix with some reference code from gstreamer code base. -Omer On Aug 20, 2008, at 1:47 PM, Luca Barbato wrote: > Peter Saint-Andre wrote: >> I'm pretty sure support for that is in Pidgin (well, it will be >> once the >> Summer of Code work is incorporated). > > People involved in separate implementation are more than welcome to > contact me so I could know who is using it ^^; > > lu > > -- > > Luca Barbato > Gentoo Council Member > Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC > http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero > > _______________________________________________ > xiph-rtp mailing list > xiph-rtp at xiph.org > http://lists.xiph.org/mailman/listinfo/xiph-rtp From justivo at gmail.com Wed Aug 20 13:15:47 2008 From: justivo at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?Ivo_Emanuel_Gon=C3=A7alves?=) Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2008 21:15:47 +0100 Subject: [xiph-rtp] theora-rtp In-Reply-To: <71B566D5-C5FA-46AE-A7EA-659F6A3EFFDC@cs.columbia.edu> References: <1AC7C3FF-1243-4F71-993E-A12527CCEA6F@cs.columbia.edu> <48AC42AC.6030903@gentoo.org> <48AC44AB.2010908@stpeter.im> <48AC58AA.6050208@gentoo.org> <71B566D5-C5FA-46AE-A7EA-659F6A3EFFDC@cs.columbia.edu> Message-ID: On 8/20/08, Omer Boyaci wrote: > I believe that, the life will be easy for developers of different > systems > if there would be an RFC for theora. Yes, indeed, but as you have heard it is being worked on, so expect it to show up sooner or later. Meanwhile, as Luca explained, the depackatization will follow a very similar logic to the one described in the RFC for Vorbis RTP, so instead of creating different implementations programmers are invited to study that RFC plus Theora RTP's draft (while its own RFC is not available). Also useful for those who wish to use audio alongside Theora but require something more optimized for voice, you should look into the Speex RTP spec, http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avt-rtp-speex-05 soon to become an RFC as well. > We have also developed an application and desktop sharing system which > supports theora Cool. > but I used my own payload format in the > implementation due to lack of an RFC spec for theora. Not so cool. > We will also preparing an RFC for application and desktop sharing. It > will support all media formats, but we will recommend Theora because > it is good enough, open source and license free. Thank you. That's very good to hear. > Also, MJPEG--RTP RFC gives some example C code for de/packetization. I > believe, Luca can also add an appendix with some reference code from > gstreamer code base. There's also some code available in https://svn.xiph.org but I am not sure how useful it is at the moment. -Ivo